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Winston media from PFT

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On the field.... Winston is young and has been making progress.   He was also injured last season, and my recollection was that he played with the injury for 2 games before taking a few games off, and chances are that he wasn't 100% upon return.  The defense was collapsing a lot, and he might have been taking risks because the offense needed to be very productive for the Bucs to win.  So, we need another season or two to evaluate his on the field play.

Off the field is a different story.

 

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5 hours ago, Bucaroo Bonzai said:

I'm not sure that Brooks was any better.  Brooks did his job and he did it extremely well, but he wasn't the guy ralllying the troops

I’m sure you’re a swell guy and I’m not trying to be a dick, but are you ducking serious with some of the shit you post???

Ask anyone who played for that defense and Brooks was THE leader of that defense no questions about it. 

He was plenty “in your face” and constantly “rallied the troops” or whatever stupid fucking leadership cliche you want to use. 

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7 hours ago, tfree32 said:

 

I hate the rah-rah shit. Jameis looks like a complete buffoon when he tries that nonsense. Ray Lewis did as well, but since he murdered people, everyone pretended to think he was cool.

So skip the rah-rah crap. But how about setting the tone on defense? How about showing some attitude, getting in someone’s face, rallying the team, mentoring some younger players, and doing anything...ANYTHING...to make the team better?

Virtually every year McCoy gives some bullshit interview where he talks about being underappreciated, whines about how it’s unfair to expect him to be Sapp, and vows to take on more of a leadership role. But true leaders don’t talk about it....they just do it. McCoy is a veteran and by a wide margin the highest paid player on the defense. It’s not unreasonable to expect more from him than individual stats.

Such bullshit.

Just admit don’t like McCoy because your boy Suh went to Detroit and McCoy was a Buc.

Somehow I think if McCoy was a Cornhusker and Suh went to Oklahoma, and Suh ended up here and Mcoy to Detroit and was still there playing, you would tell us all how McCoy has been with the same team and put up good numbers while surrounded by shitty talent. And you would bash Suh because he would be on his third team now.

All this “leadership” “rallying the troops” “getting in peoples face” is all such bullshit. 

 

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1 hour ago, fanofdabucs said:

I’m sure you’re a swell guy and I’m not trying to be a dick, but are you ducking serious with some of the shit you post???

Ask anyone who played for that defense and Brooks was THE leader of that defense no questions about it. 

He was plenty “in your face” and constantly “rallied the troops” or whatever stupid fucking leadership cliche you want to use. 

Sapp was the enforcer, and Brooks led by example.  Perhaps there was some good cop/bad dynamic. 

But the point is that McCoy has his limits as a leader, and expecting HOF leadership from him isn't realistic.  I agree that the team lacks leaders, but getting buthurt because one of your best players on the field isn't a great leader is pretty stupid.

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I wouldn't question Brooks as a leader but I've seen both him and Sapp in a locker room situation. Sapp was more like a frikin gang boss. Very active and players followed him around like a bunch a little ducks trying to stay close to mama.

McCoy? It's hard to say what influence he has in the locker room based on his public demeanor but he might command some respect.

It's a different team and time though. They say jafukinboob is a leader and that's something different altogether.

 

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3 hours ago, fanofdabucs said:

Such bullshit.

Just admit don’t like McCoy because your boy Suh went to Detroit and McCoy was a Buc.

Somehow I think if McCoy was a Cornhusker and Suh went to Oklahoma, and Suh ended up here and Mcoy to Detroit and was still there playing, you would tell us all how McCoy has been with the same team and put up good numbers while surrounded by shitty talent. And you would bash Suh because he would be on his third team now.

All this “leadership” “rallying the troops” “getting in peoples face” is all such bullshit. 

 

Are you McCoy's agent, boyfriend , or both? Holy shit. He's a good player, no doubt. But he's not tough, he doesn't instill toughness in the team, and he's clearly not a leader. 

 

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 My impression was that Brooks was a mentor and lead by example type of player....not an enforcer and not the guy giving a lot of pep speeches.   We could use Ronde Barber as an example.  He wasn't a leader and only took on that role (if you call it that) at the end so they'd keep playing him, but did you want him on your team (while he was still playing at a high level)?

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I'm not calling anyone out individually, but if you believe that Brooks was only a leader in the sense that he provided the example on the field, you are woefully, tragically, pathetically, insufferably, ridiculously misinformed.

http://www.tbo.com/sports/bucs/brooks/to-bucs-teammates-no-55-known-as-the-godfather-20140731/

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.... I would go so far as to say Brooks was not only the best leader the Bucs have ever had, I can't think of a single player or coach in the history of sport that I would rather have leading and motivating my team, in any sport or other endeavor,  than Derrick fucking Brooks. So there. :)

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OFF TOPIC, BECAUSE THE TOPIC IS WINSTON

I have long given up hope for McCoy to be an "overly vocal" leader. That just isn't him and that is ok when you have other personalities on the defensive side of the ball (Kwon and Grimes come to mind immediately).

What I want from McCoy is very simple. Be a productive pass rushing force for the D-Line. I have relaxed my disdain for him quite a bit, because it took me long enough to figure out 2 things:

1) He isn't a rah rah vocal leader.

2) He isn't as disruptive a force as Sapp (and yes, some of Sapp's success was because of the collection of talent around him).

As long as Gerald pulls his weight on the D-Line (and in most cases, I think he probably does that), he is talented enough to become a force. Unfortunately, he has been surrounded by turds his entire career in Tampa on the D-Line. He just isn't on the same level of leadership as say a Brooks or Lynch.

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22 hours ago, Bucaroo Bonzai said:

Okay, so where do you rank McCoy in all this, and do you think we need him to be a good/great player and a leader as well?

To paraphrase Dennis Green, McCoy is who we thought he was. Looking back, he's been well worth the first round pick, in that he's an elite player at his position. But no matter how much he might try to lead, he just doesn't have that in his DNA. In that sense, McCoy and Winston are very much alike. They both desperately want to be the alpha dog, but they're just so fucking ridiculous when they try to assume that role that it ends up doing more harm than good. The Bucs need some charisma and leadership on both sides of the ball, but you just can't point a finger and anoint someone. It's got to come from within.  I think it's some point a Bucs player will call Winston out. The guy who does it may very well end up being The One 

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