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Firing Gruden -- a Retrospective

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Apparently bumping old threads became forbidden by the infrastructure of bucschat. 

But this one started by SF is a beauty to look at the views about Gruden. Some of it (stupid ass Soonkwelch) is predctable, other inputs may surprise you, but in the end it boils out the damn truth -- the Glazertards are the most ignorant, incompetent losers in the NFL ownership ranks. No it's not the Browns. Why? The Browns were never good. The Bucs had a decade of competence after two decades of not. So the Glazertards decide to axe the hardest working coach in the business after two consecutive 9-7 seasons. 

Get out your barf bags. 

http://www.bucschat.com/topic/35513-fire-gruden-now/

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It was a bad decision, but the problem was that ownership decided to run the team on the cheap.   Regardless of how good Gruden was, the firing decision was going to look bad because they didn't go out and find the best coach/GM they could find, spend the money on scouting, or even spend money on players when the NFL virtually went capless before the new CBA.

They moved the coffee boy up to GM when he had whiffed on draft picks for some time, and our defensive backs coach as our HC.  We paid them a pittance in terms of coach/GM money, but it was more money than either of them had ever seen and because they were overpaid, they were willing to keep their mouths shut about how the team was being run.  Then we cut a bunch of staff, and I'd wager there were years where we are at about 65% of the prior salary cap.

It was part of a larger problem, and had Gruden and Allen been Tony Dungy and Rich McKay, we'd still be crying about how bad a decision it was.

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On 2/19/2018 at 3:40 PM, Gulf Shore Steve said:

Without looking at the thread, my opinion at the time was that the move to fire Gruden and Allen was ok, it was who they replaced them with which was the problem.

 

Yep.

I did not want Gruden to go, nor Allen. I was not disappointed that it was done, but when they brought in Rah I was horrified.

 

 

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12 hours ago, Bucaroo Bonzai said:

Nice to hear him say it...just to shut up anyone who felt it could happen.  Chances were lower than SF remarrying his ex wife without a prenup and paying for a $50,000 wedding himself with only her family invited.

Don't forget the lesbian Patriot fan ex neighbors, they would be best man. 

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17 hours ago, Bucaroo Bonzai said:

Nice to hear him say it...just to shut up anyone who felt it could happen.  Chances were lower than SF remarrying his ex wife without a prenup and paying for a $50,000 wedding himself with only her family invited.

Yeah that was pretty much a "not if you were the last NFL team on Earth" kind of statement...

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When Gruden was fired, it was time for him to go. The problem was in who the replacement was.

While Gruden led the Bucs to their only Super Bowl, I don't believe him to be any level of coach savant. He's probably no better than the guy the Bucs have currently. Didn't think he'd help if he came back.

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 Hard to say with Gruden because they had been running a team with cap issues throughout.  My impression is that the owners told him and Allen that their finances were tight and they needed to wait a year before spending all that cap space they finally had.  Then they were fired.  My feeling is that Gruden was a great coach for motivating players and getting guys to the next level, but not for developing them.  Timing was good for firing Gruden.  They either needed to commit to him for another 5 years or change coaches.  We were losing our DC, offense wasn't worth writing home about, and he hadn't developed or found a quarterback.  GM Allen really hadn't impressed either (credit goes to his assistant).

But it isn't like we brought in a replacement head coach.  There was no interest in winning.

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1 hour ago, Gulf Shore Steve said:

The problem was in who the replacement was. 

He's probably no better than the guy the Bucs have currently. Didn't think he'd help if he came back.

You're words are blasphemous as we've been through a long period of embarrassing shit, not to mention a sound fleecing, to get to back to a level of coaching which may possibly be as good or better than Gruden's.

The problem sits with cloven hooves as Pan atop their glittering mound, their phallic deity delivering innocent souls to the inferno, as we again await their sirens.

Or yeah, you could be right. A few ...OK. some, bad decisions and one can cherry pick which ones to bitch about. 

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43 minutes ago, Bucaroo Bonzai said:

But all the bad decisions boil down to a single one:  they chose to run the team on the cheap for 4-6 years gutting infrastructure and team chemistry.  Bad decisions were made because they paid for bad decision makers.

They're still likely of that ilk and it's soon a decade.

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On the topic of Gruden and the Bucs, at the JBF site where they don't even have the Hooter's hooters of the day anymore there is a quote from an Ira Kaufman podcast relating a conversation he had with the coach about what he saw at Buc practices when he was in town for the ROH ceremony. Here it is and it ain't particularly comforting:

“‘Awful. Awful. Practice habits, terrible. Ball on the ground all the time.’ Ira said quoting Chucky.

“He was appalled. Gruden was appalled at Bucs practice, maybe more than one. It might have been multiple practices. That was during the five-game losing streak. The Bucs were still playing hard, but they were sloppy. They were sloppy. It took Gruden about 90 seconds to realize just how sloppy they were. He was not impressed. Was that a factor in him joining the Raiders? No. There were 100 million factors. He was absolutely unimpressed by the Buc practice.”

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You're just figuring this out now? What makes your opinion worth anything, finally? Just saying. 

You guys are part of the same crowd who got "Guruden" fired in the first place. Just learn how to shut your c*ck sucker. Going by this rate, perhaps that will be done in 2027.

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21 hours ago, bucs63 said:

On the topic of Gruden and the Bucs, at the JBF site where they don't even have the Hooter's hooters of the day anymore there is a quote from an Ira Kaufman podcast relating a conversation he had with the coach about what he saw at Buc practices when he was in town for the ROH ceremony. Here it is and it ain't particularly comforting:

“‘Awful. Awful. Practice habits, terrible. Ball on the ground all the time.’ Ira said quoting Chucky.

“He was appalled. Gruden was appalled at Bucs practice, maybe more than one. It might have been multiple practices. That was during the five-game losing streak. The Bucs were still playing hard, but they were sloppy. They were sloppy. It took Gruden about 90 seconds to realize just how sloppy they were. He was not impressed. Was that a factor in him joining the Raiders? No. There were 100 million factors. He was absolutely unimpressed by the Buc practice.”

I'll point out how accurate and believable Ira is on Jon Gruden and what was happening that week. He tweeted  a couple of days before....if not the day before....it was revealed that Gruden was going to the Raiders that Jon Gruden was comin' back and comin' back to the Bucs.

So I wouldn't take anything he says with any validity at all.

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Or maybe you do take his point seriously. How many games have the Bucs started out looking unprepared so far? Hell the last two seasons the Bucs looked unprepared at the beginning quarter or so of the season. How many sloppy tackles, penalties, efforts to play the ball, etc. All things that good practices are supposed to clean up. I think that what Ira talked about my be more to the heart of the Bucs' issues than some might think.

There is a saying, you play like you practice. And the Bucs have been playing sloppy all along.

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